Very Early Rover 75 Tourer CDTi Auto
Discussion
I was after something new to lower the tone of my neighbourhood with - not content with the E60 M5 rattling everyone's windows to bits and the 525d leaving a cloud of fog in its wake I decided I need... another old Rover!
Joking aside, those who know me will know I have a long history of various old Rovers - from the rather lovely 620ti through to 'lesser appreciated' examples such as the MG ZS Diesel.
This all stems from my job; in 2013 I started an MG Rover specialist parts supply business that has since blossomed (and sold in 2019) - but I still work for the new owner and I was given this car a little project to keep my idle hands a bit busier.
She's a very early Rover 75 Tourer - under BMW's stewardship the Tourer wasn't allowed to be developed, however once BMW sold up the door to plush-yet-useful transport of large objects was opened.
This car was registered just 23 days after the launch of the Tourer - making it one of the earliest examples I'm aware of. Most of the Tourer-specific trim has detailed labels from suppliers present, something I've never seen on one of these before.
The bad part? The gearbox is toast - the 75 / ZT automatic both use the Jatco JF506E transmission, which while very reliable in most ways does have one flaw only present in 'boxes made before 2002.
The flaw is a hairline crack appearing in the 'reverse piston' - which confusingly looks nothing like a piston, and when it fails doesn't impede operation of reverse either!
The piston itself houses the 'high clutch' assembly which is used in gears 3, 4 and 5 - when it cracks, pressure on the clutches is reduced to almost zero allowing them to slip and disintegrate.
Lo and behold, the exact symtoms this car has... joy! More on that later though.
Here she is waiting to be collected - looking quite sorry for herself:
More to follow later.
Joking aside, those who know me will know I have a long history of various old Rovers - from the rather lovely 620ti through to 'lesser appreciated' examples such as the MG ZS Diesel.
This all stems from my job; in 2013 I started an MG Rover specialist parts supply business that has since blossomed (and sold in 2019) - but I still work for the new owner and I was given this car a little project to keep my idle hands a bit busier.
She's a very early Rover 75 Tourer - under BMW's stewardship the Tourer wasn't allowed to be developed, however once BMW sold up the door to plush-yet-useful transport of large objects was opened.
This car was registered just 23 days after the launch of the Tourer - making it one of the earliest examples I'm aware of. Most of the Tourer-specific trim has detailed labels from suppliers present, something I've never seen on one of these before.
The bad part? The gearbox is toast - the 75 / ZT automatic both use the Jatco JF506E transmission, which while very reliable in most ways does have one flaw only present in 'boxes made before 2002.
The flaw is a hairline crack appearing in the 'reverse piston' - which confusingly looks nothing like a piston, and when it fails doesn't impede operation of reverse either!
The piston itself houses the 'high clutch' assembly which is used in gears 3, 4 and 5 - when it cracks, pressure on the clutches is reduced to almost zero allowing them to slip and disintegrate.
Lo and behold, the exact symtoms this car has... joy! More on that later though.
Here she is waiting to be collected - looking quite sorry for herself:
More to follow later.
Once back home, two things were clear - that I'd found a great example of an early 75 (having just 77,000 miles) and that I'd have my work cut out getting her back on the road.
While the BMW-based Diesel engine runs like its fresh off the line, the interior and paintwork leave a lot to be desired - I'll need to spend a fair bit of time taking her back to her former glory.
Interior when collected:
A quick spruce up had an immediate effect, but it's nowhere near as good as I'd like yet:
The paintwork came up well, however the mudflaps fitted have caused the front wings to corrode quite badly.
After a decent wash:
I did notice the interior was a little damp - time to whack the hulking great dehumidifier that I have standing by for such events in the boot, and set about fixing the 'usual places' these let in water.
Work done to prevent ingress includes:
- Sunroof drains modified to resolve the poor factory design and drains cleared
- Missing scuttle clips replaced
- Sealant applied to the rear of external trim clips where accessible
- Captain Tolley's Creeping Crack Cure applied to hard-to-reach external trim clips
When doing the above I found the scuttle itself was cracked into 3 pieces - luckily we'd just taken delivery of 20 at the business so I 'borrowed' one to test fit...
It feels like I've been putting off the inevitable gearbox repair - so yesterday I finally plucked up the courage to pick up the tools and crack 'er open.
Not a bad job so far - just a bit fiddly in places.
I removed the battery box, fuel filter and pump etc to allow access to the gearbox mount bolts - the gearbox needs to be lowered down to get the cover off and remove it.
Once the gearbox was dropped down a little I removed the wheelarch liner and then all the bolts holding the cover in place - with a little pry this popped off, and gearbox oil went everywhere (note to self - drain beforehand next time!)
To remove the cover completely I had to drop the subframe a couple of inches - it wouldn't quite fit through the gap between inner arch and subframe.
Once removed I could pull the full drum assembly from the gearbox... and then the fun began!
Getting the drum assembly to release the reverse piston itself was pretty fun - the clutch packs need to be removed a step at a time by releasing the circlips as you go, I did notice the High Clutch Assembly in this was absolutely knackered (there's 5 clutch plates, all 5 were damaged very badly).
Finally, l needed to apply some compression to the last part in order to split it - there's a retaining ring holding a spring between the reverse piston and drum itself, so I need to compress this to release the retaining ring.
The crack is circled in blue; took me a while to spot but oh boy is she a beauty.
More to follow when the replacement clutches arrive.
While the BMW-based Diesel engine runs like its fresh off the line, the interior and paintwork leave a lot to be desired - I'll need to spend a fair bit of time taking her back to her former glory.
Interior when collected:
A quick spruce up had an immediate effect, but it's nowhere near as good as I'd like yet:
The paintwork came up well, however the mudflaps fitted have caused the front wings to corrode quite badly.
After a decent wash:
I did notice the interior was a little damp - time to whack the hulking great dehumidifier that I have standing by for such events in the boot, and set about fixing the 'usual places' these let in water.
Work done to prevent ingress includes:
- Sunroof drains modified to resolve the poor factory design and drains cleared
- Missing scuttle clips replaced
- Sealant applied to the rear of external trim clips where accessible
- Captain Tolley's Creeping Crack Cure applied to hard-to-reach external trim clips
When doing the above I found the scuttle itself was cracked into 3 pieces - luckily we'd just taken delivery of 20 at the business so I 'borrowed' one to test fit...
It feels like I've been putting off the inevitable gearbox repair - so yesterday I finally plucked up the courage to pick up the tools and crack 'er open.
Not a bad job so far - just a bit fiddly in places.
I removed the battery box, fuel filter and pump etc to allow access to the gearbox mount bolts - the gearbox needs to be lowered down to get the cover off and remove it.
Once the gearbox was dropped down a little I removed the wheelarch liner and then all the bolts holding the cover in place - with a little pry this popped off, and gearbox oil went everywhere (note to self - drain beforehand next time!)
To remove the cover completely I had to drop the subframe a couple of inches - it wouldn't quite fit through the gap between inner arch and subframe.
Once removed I could pull the full drum assembly from the gearbox... and then the fun began!
Getting the drum assembly to release the reverse piston itself was pretty fun - the clutch packs need to be removed a step at a time by releasing the circlips as you go, I did notice the High Clutch Assembly in this was absolutely knackered (there's 5 clutch plates, all 5 were damaged very badly).
Finally, l needed to apply some compression to the last part in order to split it - there's a retaining ring holding a spring between the reverse piston and drum itself, so I need to compress this to release the retaining ring.
The crack is circled in blue; took me a while to spot but oh boy is she a beauty.
More to follow when the replacement clutches arrive.
No idea if its good advice or not but on all my cars I’ve removed the rubbery sponges that fill the gaps at the base of the bonnet by the hinges. I found that they allow wet leaves, twigs muck and moisture to persist creating a great spot for rust in a rather critical area.
Removed will allow air to get there and dry it out.
I also remove the little rubber grommets that are almost sadistically put there to keep a film of moisture where the metal is joined.
On my old Omega it had a habit of creating a puddle, right where the ecu lives!
Removed will allow air to get there and dry it out.
I also remove the little rubber grommets that are almost sadistically put there to keep a film of moisture where the metal is joined.
On my old Omega it had a habit of creating a puddle, right where the ecu lives!
Hello all,
Thanks for the tips above - appreciated as always.
No major updates of any significance - the gearbox repair above didn't completely fix the issue so I opted to locate a good, used item and fit that instead.
I don't have the heavy lifting gear here, so we're off on an adventure!
More updates to follow when I've got the sod in bits all over my mate's workshop floor.
Thanks for the tips above - appreciated as always.
No major updates of any significance - the gearbox repair above didn't completely fix the issue so I opted to locate a good, used item and fit that instead.
I don't have the heavy lifting gear here, so we're off on an adventure!
More updates to follow when I've got the sod in bits all over my mate's workshop floor.
mattyprice4004 said:
Hello all,
Thanks for the tips above - appreciated as always.
No major updates of any significance - the gearbox repair above didn't completely fix the issue so I opted to locate a good, used item and fit that instead.
I don't have the heavy lifting gear here, so we're off on an adventure!
More updates to follow when I've got the sod in bits all over my mate's workshop floor.
They are good cars if they are well cared for. I sold a facelift one a few days ago with 42k miles for decent money but took about a month of time wasters to find the right buyer. People that came up to see it said ' I didn't think it would be as good as the photos' and they had budget of £1k so not even close to buying it. Thanks for the tips above - appreciated as always.
No major updates of any significance - the gearbox repair above didn't completely fix the issue so I opted to locate a good, used item and fit that instead.
I don't have the heavy lifting gear here, so we're off on an adventure!
More updates to follow when I've got the sod in bits all over my mate's workshop floor.
I had a Mk1 for two years and put a good few miles on it before selling it for exactly what I paid for it and the difference between an early MK1 and a MK2 is night and day. The interior of a pre project drive car screams quality and a late MK1 interior just looks cheap.
Good cars, I had a ZT-T years ago
If the wipers start going at random, have a look in the boot at the CD changer plug
Mine was wet and corroded, and despite being at the other end of the car, and a totally different system, caused the wipers to activate randomly (!)
I know its unlikely yours will be affected, but it took me so blooody long to find the cause of the fault i'm putting it here anyway for the sanity of others in the future
God speed
If the wipers start going at random, have a look in the boot at the CD changer plug
Mine was wet and corroded, and despite being at the other end of the car, and a totally different system, caused the wipers to activate randomly (!)
I know its unlikely yours will be affected, but it took me so blooody long to find the cause of the fault i'm putting it here anyway for the sanity of others in the future
God speed
sutoka said:
They are good cars if they are well cared for. I sold a facelift one a few days ago with 42k miles for decent money but took about a month of time wasters to find the right buyer. People that came up to see it said ' I didn't think it would be as good as the photos' and they had budget of £1k so not even close to buying it.
I had a Mk1 for two years and put a good few miles on it before selling it for exactly what I paid for it and the difference between an early MK1 and a MK2 is night and day. The interior of a pre project drive car screams quality and a late MK1 interior just looks cheap.
They're smashing cars, but I found what you have - they don't half attract some 'dreamers' when selling. I had a Mk1 for two years and put a good few miles on it before selling it for exactly what I paid for it and the difference between an early MK1 and a MK2 is night and day. The interior of a pre project drive car screams quality and a late MK1 interior just looks cheap.
The early Mk1 is worlds away in terms of quality; I spent the majority of the time I owned the MG Rover spares business pottering around in a late Mk1 ZT-T.
While it was a very capable car and probably carried around 30,000 parcels for me during the time I had it, the quality just wasn't there when in the cockpit.
Let's see how this one feels when she's back from surgery
996Keef said:
Good cars, I had a ZT-T years ago
If the wipers start going at random, have a look in the boot at the CD changer plug
Mine was wet and corroded, and despite being at the other end of the car, and a totally different system, caused the wipers to activate randomly (!)
I know its unlikely yours will be affected, but it took me so blooody long to find the cause of the fault i'm putting it here anyway for the sanity of others in the future
God speed
Excellent bit of info - hopefully it helps someone else (or maybe even me) one day - that's very odd! If the wipers start going at random, have a look in the boot at the CD changer plug
Mine was wet and corroded, and despite being at the other end of the car, and a totally different system, caused the wipers to activate randomly (!)
I know its unlikely yours will be affected, but it took me so blooody long to find the cause of the fault i'm putting it here anyway for the sanity of others in the future
God speed
I did close to 100,000 miles in my ZT-T - 99% of it was utterly reliable and effortless. Smashing cars
Update - after some jiggery pokery with the (very very) heavy gearbox, she lives!
Obligatory picture with broken gearbox:
After this she went for MOT - while sat a spring had let go, and the previous owner had let the tyres get a little low in tread on 2 corners.
Combined with the usual front drop links both having play and a little corrosion on the rear subframe, she predictably failed - but one afternoon on the spanners by the garage (with a little help from yours truly) we're back in business.
She's now on the road with a fresh MOT; I'm planning to use her while the trusty 525d undergoes some routine work I've been putting off for a while.
I tell you what, she's an absolute dream to drive. I'd forgotten just how charming these big old buses are!
Obligatory picture with broken gearbox:
After this she went for MOT - while sat a spring had let go, and the previous owner had let the tyres get a little low in tread on 2 corners.
Combined with the usual front drop links both having play and a little corrosion on the rear subframe, she predictably failed - but one afternoon on the spanners by the garage (with a little help from yours truly) we're back in business.
She's now on the road with a fresh MOT; I'm planning to use her while the trusty 525d undergoes some routine work I've been putting off for a while.
I tell you what, she's an absolute dream to drive. I'd forgotten just how charming these big old buses are!
Time for another update!
This one has been 100% reliable which is great news - and with the 525d back to health it's time to move her on for another project.
I did notice the brakes were a bit spongy on the last run out, and soon found out why... one of the brake lines the garage replaced for the MOT was weeping quite a lot.
That'll be why! I'm guessing the union wasn't clamped down enough or the flare wasn't perfect - to be sure I got the flaring tool out to re-do it, re-tightened and it's fine now.
This is why whenever I have an issue with a car, I always look towards any recently completed work if it could be relevant - more often than not it's a faulty part / poor workmanship to blame. Serves me right for being lazy and not doing it myself in the first place...
Luckily I have a buyer lined up; a good friend of mine has just bought a dog that'll grow to the size of a small horse, so needs to replace his Fiesta with something more suitable.
She'll remain local and I'll still be taking care of her - and will of course update as I go.
I still love how after 20 years the 75 still has a fantastic ride and so many excellent qualities as a daily car; and with so many specialists out there for the marque they're increasingly easy to own as a 'modern classic'.
The company I founded and since sold has added more than 20 previously unavailable parts to their inventory for the 75 this year alone - great news for owners.
This one has been 100% reliable which is great news - and with the 525d back to health it's time to move her on for another project.
I did notice the brakes were a bit spongy on the last run out, and soon found out why... one of the brake lines the garage replaced for the MOT was weeping quite a lot.
That'll be why! I'm guessing the union wasn't clamped down enough or the flare wasn't perfect - to be sure I got the flaring tool out to re-do it, re-tightened and it's fine now.
This is why whenever I have an issue with a car, I always look towards any recently completed work if it could be relevant - more often than not it's a faulty part / poor workmanship to blame. Serves me right for being lazy and not doing it myself in the first place...
Luckily I have a buyer lined up; a good friend of mine has just bought a dog that'll grow to the size of a small horse, so needs to replace his Fiesta with something more suitable.
She'll remain local and I'll still be taking care of her - and will of course update as I go.
I still love how after 20 years the 75 still has a fantastic ride and so many excellent qualities as a daily car; and with so many specialists out there for the marque they're increasingly easy to own as a 'modern classic'.
The company I founded and since sold has added more than 20 previously unavailable parts to their inventory for the 75 this year alone - great news for owners.
Well, it turns out the new owner is rather fond of this car - so we booked into Force Tuning in Leominster (owned and run by a good friend of mine) for a day out.
He's a very good 75 / ZT specialist - and given the reasonable list of issues we found that need attention I figured it was worth a trip.
Loading the 75 with goodies for the trip down:
The work completed at Force Tuning was mainly jobs that are easier on a ramp - I'm always happy to get my hands dirty, but some jobs are just so much easier when the car is 6 feet up!
- A/C vacuumed down and regassed
- Underside cleaned up and coated properly where corrosion is starting
- New radiator fan fitted (original was completely dead on all 3 speeds)
- Projector headlight units fitted (a million times better than the originals)
- Ambient temperature sensor behind bumper swapped
- Undertray refitted with correct fittings
- Exhaust rear section replaced
- Cruise control and a few other options enabled on T4
She's running a dream now, with ice cold A/C and all major functions working as intended.
One last issue to sort it a rear door that seems to have deadlocked itself - that'll need a bit of a fight to get open, but we have a new actuator ready to fit.
He's a very good 75 / ZT specialist - and given the reasonable list of issues we found that need attention I figured it was worth a trip.
Loading the 75 with goodies for the trip down:
The work completed at Force Tuning was mainly jobs that are easier on a ramp - I'm always happy to get my hands dirty, but some jobs are just so much easier when the car is 6 feet up!
- A/C vacuumed down and regassed
- Underside cleaned up and coated properly where corrosion is starting
- New radiator fan fitted (original was completely dead on all 3 speeds)
- Projector headlight units fitted (a million times better than the originals)
- Ambient temperature sensor behind bumper swapped
- Undertray refitted with correct fittings
- Exhaust rear section replaced
- Cruise control and a few other options enabled on T4
She's running a dream now, with ice cold A/C and all major functions working as intended.
One last issue to sort it a rear door that seems to have deadlocked itself - that'll need a bit of a fight to get open, but we have a new actuator ready to fit.
Update - the rear driver's side door has proven to be an absolute nightmare, but as to be expected when the rest of the car has been as good as gold for the new owner.
We fought the door card off (incredible fun with the door stuck closed) and opened the door - swapping the mechanism was a bit fiddly but nothing a couple of cold beers and a decent tool kit couldn't sort.
Adjusting the internal mechanism to the correct 'feel' on the outside door handle is a bit of fun - the threaded bar sits within a plastic thread, and you need to manually disconnect the whole lot, rotate the threaded bar a few times and then hope you're somewhere near right.
After 10 attempts or so... success!
2 days later, I get a message from the friend letting me know that the door refuses to open, which was a shame as he was proudly showing someone at work the newly-working locking mechanism at the time.
These things are sent to try us... I'll update with more pictures of the ensuing battle once I find the willpower to fight that door card off again.
We fought the door card off (incredible fun with the door stuck closed) and opened the door - swapping the mechanism was a bit fiddly but nothing a couple of cold beers and a decent tool kit couldn't sort.
Adjusting the internal mechanism to the correct 'feel' on the outside door handle is a bit of fun - the threaded bar sits within a plastic thread, and you need to manually disconnect the whole lot, rotate the threaded bar a few times and then hope you're somewhere near right.
After 10 attempts or so... success!
2 days later, I get a message from the friend letting me know that the door refuses to open, which was a shame as he was proudly showing someone at work the newly-working locking mechanism at the time.
These things are sent to try us... I'll update with more pictures of the ensuing battle once I find the willpower to fight that door card off again.
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